TiborasaurusRex On What Made America Great
Sitting at the table of the Father, obeying His moral law, as a sovereign individual, at peace with others.
Sitting at the table of the Father, obeying His moral law, as a sovereign individual, at peace with others.
I still think it’s an impressive cartridge, with power greater than 30-30 or 300 Blackout, able to be shot from a MSR, and much less recoil than .450 Bushmaster.
So how’s that plan to confiscate 18 million MSRs going, controllers? You think you’ll get them all?
Here is a useful graph from Ammoland.

There has been a general trend upwards for a very long time. Excel or TableCurve-2D could easily fit a smoothed curve with that data with a decent correlation coefficient. Do you see that increase right at the end of 2019? It’s seasonal, no doubt, like the rest of the repeatable perturbations.
But I don’t expect to see it go back down very far or fast in 2020. I think 2020 is the year you want to be in the firearms manufacturing and sales business.
Via WRSA, this is a worthy read about Ruby Ridge.

What a farce. All of the things that happened at Ruby Ridge over an inch or less of barrel length. Because Congress. Because rulers.
Survival Blog, from a writer named Vigilant in Virginia.
… 22 Virginia counties have adopted second amendment sanctuary resolutions. My county was among them. I went to the recent public hearing regarding this matter and was joined there by several hundred patriotic Americans in support of their right to keep and bear arms. Many speakers boldly noted to the Board of Supervisors that the Second Amendment is not about hunting, but maintaining an armed citizenry to inhibit government tyranny. The turnout and knowledge level of these fellow citizens is encouraging and makes me hopeful that freedom will be defended, that many will not simply capitulate to socialism or worse.
However, I must temper the enthusiasm of my fellow patriots. The Supervisors in my county have at times taken breathtakingly spineless actions in order to raise taxes, to have someone else to blame. And our county is poorly run by a good old boy network of people growing government for their own benefit. These people protect their own hind ends at all costs, and they commit to no position that will cost them a dime or any credibility with the sleepy voters. Let’s not think that all of a sudden these wimps have awakened to the reality of militant liberalism and are ready to fight. Nothing could be further from the truth.
The resolutions being adopted have no force of law or regulation. The Supervisors in Virginia counties have no authority over local sheriffs, and they have no sway over the State Police, National Guard, Federal law enforcement, or anyone else who might be tasked with gun confiscation. Right before passing the 2A resolution, our Board recognized some EMS personnel for good work, and the 2A document has just as much legal weight as the certificates of appreciation handed to the firemen.
The sheriff stood up in our meeting and proclaimed loudly that he was not going to ignore enforcement of any law, but he is hearing our concerns. He qualified his support multiple times, while sounding like he is on our side. Only time will tell.
Look, when the order for gun confiscation comes down, any sheriff who does not comply will eventually be removed by force by the feds or State Police. If any county politician stands up against them, they will be removed as well. I’ve long believed that gun confiscation will not be practical to implement until food rationing is in place, where the government will have leverage over the population and law enforcement through selective food distribution. Just like in Connecticut and New Jersey today where outlawing firearms/magazines has resulted in embarrassingly few surrenders of hardware, gun owners are not going to give up their firearms without either a fight, or being starved out.
What these 2A sanctuary counties are doing is great, as far as it goes, but don’t expect your local sheriff’s deputies to block the Fed’s access to your home when the order happens. This is the order you may not even hear about until that knock comes at your door. All politicians do everything to serve themselves, all the time, without exception.
It’s just as I’ve said all along. And I would add LEOs to the mix of people who serve themselves, or perhaps “Vigilant in Virginia” is doing that by categorizing them as politicians.
Declarations of sanctuaries is merely symbolic and can only be a first step. It sends a message, but unless and until local and county politicians and LEOs are willing to put their careers and safety on the line arresting State or FedGov agents who attempt to enforce confiscatory orders, this goes nowhere. It will have been nothing more than a flash in a pan.
In the comments there is this interesting web site, https://keepVA2A.com, which is tracking sanctuary counties and the ongoing meetings and protests.
VIRGINIA BEACH, Va. (WAVY) — The Second Amendment of the U.S. Constitution was at the front of the minds of both elected officials and residents Tuesday night.
When Virginia Beach City Council met Tuesday for its first meeting of the month, the Second Amendment wasn’t listed on the agenda. Yet hundreds showed up to voice their thoughts on the city becoming a “Second Amendment sanctuary.”
So much so that the City Council Chambers and all of city hall reached capacity, leaving even more people outside during the meeting. By 6:30 p.m. the crowd had swelled to the point that both the Virginia Beach Sheriff’s Office and police department were on-scene to close the road down in front of city hall.
The gun rights advocates wore orange stickers saying “Guns Save Lives” in the shadow of Building 2 at the municipal center, where six months earlier a gunman killed 12 and injured 4 others.
10 On Your Side was unable to hear who spoke before the council because of capacity and “open mic night” comments are not recorded. However, we do know one of the speakers was Vincent Smith, Division Manager for the Virginia Beach Department of Public Works, who spearheaded the request. He also has created a petition calling for a change in a policy that prohibits city employees from having guns at work.
Outside former Republican congressman and U.S. Senate candidate Scott Taylor addressed the crowd.
“I don’t want to be a felon for protecting myself and exercising my constitutional rights,” Taylor said to cheers.
He called the resolution “a political statement that tells Richmond ‘you will not infringe on our constitutional rights’.”
Members from Moms Demand Action, a dissenting group that focuses on demanding “reasonable solutions” to gun violence in America, was also in attendance.
“Even though you might see a lot of people here, obviously Virginians came out and voted for gun safety legislation this session,” said Sibel Galindez, a co-lead with the Hampton Roads chapter.
Galindez said what alarms her the most is the notion that policy could be ignored.
“Lawlessness has no place in Virginia Beach,” Galindez said.
The “sanctuary” movement has spread in Virginia since the Nov. 5 election, when Democrats gained majority control of both the State Senate and House of Delegates. Democratic Gov. Ralph Northam has said his party’s leaders will push for gun control measures and more than a dozen bills concerning firearms have already been pre-filed.
So far, 23 counties have passed resolutions ensuring they will not use their public resources to enforce any unconstitutional gun laws.
“At this point, we just have to figure out what we are empowered to do and to see if we can find out something. But obviously we have to protect the Second Amendment, we’ll figure out a way,” said Virginia Beach Mayor Bobby Dyer following the meeting.
Virginia Beach was not the only locality to hear public support for the Second Amendment on Tuesday night.
Gloucester County voted to become a “Second Amendment sanctuary” Tuesday after another lengthy public hearing.
“Lawlessness has no place in Virginia Beach,” Galindez said. But the only time the controllers believe that is when they control the laws.
I disagree with the notion that the state would be able to enforce its laws. It depends upon which laws and how.
If the county officers are willing to prevent state officers from confiscatory orders, they can stop it. If they are only willing to refuse themselves to be involved, it cannot be stopped and these protests are merely symbolic.
As for purchase of new firearms, it’s legal to buy long guns in adjacent states. It’s not legal under current ATF rules to buy handguns anywhere else without an FFL review in your home state before the weapon crosses state lines. That’s a problem because the FedGov controls that, not the state. Here it depends upon just how far the sanctuary counties and cities are willing to go to prevent FedGov from arrest and prosecutorial powers in sanctuaries.
So I see it as entirely feasible to prevent confiscation if they are willing. I see it as much more problematic to ensure the purchase of new [illegal] firearms.
It gets spicier from here. We’re only just beginning. Both sides are feeling froggy. Patriots have some real work to do in Roanoke.
GOA.
Springfield, VA — On December 2, 2019, the Home Defense and Competitive Shooting Act was introduced in the House of Representatives by Congressman Roger Marshall.
The bill undoes the egregiously unconstitutional registration, taxation, and regulation of short-barreled rifles by removing them from the National Firearms Act (NFA) and forcing the ATF to destroy all related records.
“The introduction of this bill is yet another landmark towards restoring the constitutionally-recognized right to keep and bear arms without infringement by federal regulations and whimsical rulemaking by anti-gun D.C. bureaucrats,” said Aidan Johnston, Director of Federal Affairs for GOA. “When the Founding Fathers wrote the Second Amendment, intending to protect individuals from infringements, they did not ‘leave room’ for a federal agency to regulate barrel lengths on rifles or pistols.”
Under current law, the difference between a “pistol AR-15” and a “short barreled rifle AR-15” is ATF rulemaking and mind-numbing definitions and differences between “rifle stocks” and “pistol braces.”
GOA supports a full repeal of the NFA and has challenged the NFA’s unconstitutional regulation of suppressors with the Silencers Help Us Save Hearing Act, the Hearing Protection Act, and Kettler v. US. But for far too long, other aspects of the National Firearms Act—an act of gun control by nature—have gone unchallenged in Congress.
“Now gun owners have a legislative vehicle to attack another element of the National Firearms Act’s meaningless regulation,” Johnston concluded. “GOA urges every member of the House of Representatives to cosponsor this bill.”
Okay. Even if this goes nowhere (as I suspect it will in the den of demons, gargoyles and pit vipers we call Washington, D.C.), I am now a fan of two members of the House, the first being Thomas Massie. Roger Marshall can be added to the list of good guys. It’s a short list.
Shooting Illustrated had an assessment of the Barnes Precision Carbine. It seems a nice enough gun, although for the price you’re getting into BCM and Rock River Arms prices. I do like the looks of the hand guard, though. But what caught my eye was this chart.

I find this fascinating. I’m a wonk, I admit. But even if you don’t find it as interesting as I do, I’d request that you [a] see this first and foremost as a fishing expedition, not a tutorial (because that’s not my job), and [b] keep track of similar data and send to me as you run across it.
So here’s my specific interest. Technically, MOA is a measure of precision, not accuracy. Accuracy can be modified based on sight (or optic) adjustments. If you don’t understand the difference between accuracy and precision, without going through the mathematics of the Central Limit Theorem, you can see this article. So now you’ll understand why I am using the term precision for this information.
The precision is lower for the 62 grain bullets than for 55 grain or 73 grain. It would have been nice to see additional testing with Sierra MatchKing 77 grain OTM. The difference above is nontrivial.
We saw in a previous post (not because I knew this information, but because I know how to find this information) that when the Army tested the M855A1 round, they were using accurized 1:8 twist barrels, not 1:7 twist as per MilSpec. They got worse precision with the new ammunition with 1:7 twist barrels. The M856 tracer round is 63.7 grains, and the Army had to show that the barrel could stabilize the round in order to justify the new bullet.
A twist rate that is too high can over-stabilize bullets, leading to “keyholing.” We know that, and so it’s important not to overdo barrel twist. It is fairly standard knowledge that use of the 1:7 twist leads to slightly less precision for the 55 grain, and maybe for the 62 grain green tip. But it manages to stabilize the heavier rounds, including the rounds that are apparently in current use within SpecOps.
This stabilization is necessary because of changes made to the service rifle. The original M-16 had a much milder twist rate than does the shorter barrels in use today. The shorter barrels are a direct result of trouble getting into and out of vehicles for dismounted operations, going through buildings and around walls, and the general requirements of MOUT. In order to make the ammunition work for these shorter barrels, the engineers had to monkey around with twist.
Now I’m to my main point. I take interest in the fact that the precision is lower for the medium weight bullets. I’ll stipulate that the variables are many, including perhaps the most important one, barrel harmonics. I’d love to talk to some of the original engineers and test shooters for the newest Army round, but it’s likely that I’d never get the truth.
But what I can do is compile data of my own. I’m wondering if this behavior stands up with other twist rates? I’m also interested in whether barrel length plays a role. Why did the precision decrease with medium weight bullets, and recover at the lower and higher ends?
At any rate, if you run across any data for 1:9 twist, 1:8 twist, or any more data on 1:7 twist, using different bullet weights, I’d be very interested to learn the precision of the groups and plot for future reference.
Thanks in advance.
Via Uncle comes this post from Tam.
All these people wanting you to set your hair on fire and run in circles with them about ZOMG THE DEEP STATE IS TRYING TO OUTLAW GUN TRAINING IN VIRGINIA haven’t even read the existing law. Consider that fact when deciding how much credence to give to their mouth-noises.
Calm your tits, Herschel, and do thirty seconds of research before running to your keyboard for a change.
Uncle says of this in the comments that “I’m guilty of not reading the whole thing. And MattW is too.”
Okay, whatever. That’s fine with me. But I’m not.
So let’s try this again. I saw the strike-through upon initial read, as well as the italics associated with the addition. That’s not the point as I’ve pointed out and am doing here again.
So quoting from a recent analysis.
First of all, I was also aware that Senate Bill No. 64 was an amendment to the existing code, not a new code. However, as I stated in the comments to my analysis, “This seemingly would also prohibit open carry (Virginia is an open carry state) as well as congregations of individuals as happened in Charlottesville. Finally, you’ll notice that the code is “amended and reenacted.” Apparently, no one has enforced a provision to prohibit tactical training thus far. You can bet your bottom dollar they will now.”
Taking a deeper dive into these waters, Max asks this. “Would you want some dudes down the road training in firearms and explosives with the purpose of conducting terrorist activities? I don’t think so.”
But that’s exactly what’s happening as we speak. There are Islamist paramilitary training compounds operating around the nation today, one of them in Rock Hill, South Carolina. I recall discussing this face to face a few years ago with John Guandolo at Understanding the Threat. To the best of our knowledge, this camp is still in operation with no pressure to cease operations. And take special note – South Carolina also has a law similar to the one in Virginia, i.e., S.C. Code 16-8-20. To date, no officer of South Carolina has used this law to shut down the camp in Rock Hill. One of those training camps is also in Virginia, and the Sheriff has defended them.
So there will indeed be bias in the application of this Virginia law. Besides, what constitutes a “terrorist activity” is in the eyes of the beholder. To some, an Islamist training camp constitutes a terrorist threat. Others couldn’t seem to care less (viz. the officers of SC). To some, patriots training for protection of home and hearth, or for protection against a tyrannical government, constitutes a terrorist threat.
Max and others have to remember that the way this all plays out will be a function of overzealous prosecutors and jurors who are soccer moms from Alexandria, Virginia, whose husbands probably work in some sort of government work. To them, an open carrier is a terroristic threat, and especially two open carriers who go to dinner with their families. Two or more guys who go rucking in the mountains while carrying rifles as part of their own personal fitness training would certainly be perceived by soccer moms in Alexandria as a threat. Remember what David Codrea has recently observed concerning this: “Eyes of the beholder.”
[ … ]
So the law existed before, but it will be reenacted with some modifications. I see this as a threat to liberties, and the enforcement of it may become a model for other states.
So this amended code does several things. Virginia is an open carry state. I don’t really care that some folks like to conceal or that others like to bang on open carriers. Carry however you wish, just don’t dictate to me how I carry or preach to me what you think is the best tactical approach. I’ll decide that for myself given the circumstances and my desire for comfort at the time, and whether I have to engage in non-permissive carry.
As regular readers know, I have been from the beginning an outspoken and vocal proponent and supporter of open carry. North Carolina is a “gold star” open carry state. Virginia is also an open carry state. I’ve done some work to make South Carolina an open carry state, albeit to no avail at the moment.
One thing it does is make open carry suspect now. The amendment includes ” … Assembles with one or more persons with the intent of intimidating any person or group of persons by drilling, parading, or marching with any firearm.”
Intent is an irrelevant feature of the amendment to the code. An overzealous prosecutor and a soccer mom from Alexandria, Va., can determine anything they want. I’ve seen it happen in the Charlotte, where the CMPD stopped a black man who was openly carrying. The Fourth Circuit had to slap down the CMPD. To this day the CMPD doesn’t accept that ruling. I know this because I’ve debated CMPD cops about it, and I’ve been told that to this very day they would do the same thing.
This amendment to the code can be applied to step back from being an open carry state. That bothers me a great deal. It’s my right for it to bother me a great deal. I don’t really care what you think about open or concealed carry.
There is another thing this does. This is an reenactment of the same code that is in existence at the moment. My brother is a lawyer. I happen to know that there is a debate about what exactly it means when a statute is “reenacted,” as opposed to legislative inactivity or simple amendment. I do not now and did not at the time of penning the initial post have the time to go through all of the administrative interpretations in Virginia on how this code had been applied in the past, and whether the legislature will be overruling or affirming administrative application of it, or simply putting it back into the public consciousness. Again, the legislature isn’t merely amending the code. They are reenacting it. That’s slightly different.
Virginia has turned blue. Progressives now control the governor’s mansion, the house and the senate. That means that they will get to nominate and appoint many administrative officers and judges. A reenactment of this code, once again, places it into the public consciousness with both the public and the officers of the state.
You do what you wish in Virginia, just make sure you don’t openly carry while wearing a Gadsden flag t-shirt in a Charlottesville ice cream shop. You may be arrested for being one-or-more people parading around with firearms for the purpose of intimidation.
And if you teach or train others to perform properly with firearms, you may have a target on your back. We’ll see how all of this plays out. The worst may come to pass, or Lord willing, this may have minimal effects. I hope for the later rather than the former.
So Tam, like you have probably done, I’ve done some looking at how long we have readers. It’s somewhere around two minutes. I simply cannot write down an essay every time I post. No one would read it, and no one would read it if you did that either. Thanks for playing, but when you wrote that I had not even read the existing law, not only were you incorrect, you didn’t really know that. You didn’t know that because you didn’t call me or write me to ask. That’s what you should have done. If you had, I would have sighed and typed out a long note sort of like this post. And then you would have known. You may have disagreed, but that’s okay. Disagreeing is fine. Assuming something you don’t know isn’t.
Do you do that with your gun articles too?
This analysis came by way of email today.
People have been going nuts about the proposed anti-Paramilitary law in Virginia. They have been making all sorts of stuff up, including that it will apply to martial arts instructors. It lacks rationality and does not reflect well on pro-2A folks.
So let’s take a look at this with a little bit of rationality and perspective. Firstly, let’s understand that there is already an anti-paramilitary law in Virginia, since 1987.
[ … ]
When I started MVT, I was aware of this code. This was one of the factors that led me to build the VTC in West Virginia. West Virginia has an anti-Militia law, but not an anti-paramilitary one.
Note that the key part of this code is: “such training will be employed for use in, or in furtherance of, a civil disorder.” This is the absolute key point. It is also why in the disclaimer packet for attending training at MVT, you sign that you do not intend to utilize this training for unlawful or civil disorder purposes.
Now, it seems absolutely fair to me that State Government does not want anyone training for the purposes of Civil Disorder. Would you want some dudes down the road training in firearms and explosives with the purpose of conducting terrorist activities? I don’t think so. So the key point here, and why you must take care to protect yourself, is not so much the law itself, but the political motivations behind the politicians and enforcement agencies. And we now have a situation where Virginia has gone blue in the legislature and we face very real threats to the 2A.
My assessment of this amendment to the current law is that it is aimed specifically at armed protest marches that may / will occur if / when some of the new anti-2A laws are passed in the 2020 session. Also, if you are not careful with your rhetoric, you may be prosecuted under any parts of this law. I have already seen talk of lobby day being an armed protest, which will likely be before this law is in effect. Anyone showing up armed at any of these sort of political protests will be at risk from this law. This applies to militia groups from both sides of the political divide, and we have already seen leftist groups showing up armed to protests. I think this new law is an attempt to head off this kind of armed protest to the proposed anti-2A laws in the 2020 session.
Of course, depending on the political climate, we cannot expect this to be applied equally across the political spectrum. It should not be applied to private or commercial tactical or firearms training, but it may be if you become a target due to rhetoric. An intent for civil disorder needs to be shown, and a snitch could provide that. At least enough that your life is seriously impacted by law enforcement action, even if it is ultimately not proved in court.
I believe that a greater threat is the push for sweeping anti-2A laws coming in the 2020 session. I can’t understand the drive of some to protest while openly armed. That isn’t what firearms are for, and by doing so you may will put yourself in a poor tactical situation should it kick off due to any number of potential causes.
The rest of Max’s analysis can be read here.
I agree with some of this, but I also disagree with some of it, or at least, I would emphasize different things.
First of all, I was also aware that Senate Bill No. 64 was an amendment to the existing code, not a new code. However, as I stated in the comments to my analysis, “This seemingly would also prohibit open carry (Virginia is an open carry state) as well as congregations of individuals as happened in Charlottesville. Finally, you’ll notice that the code is “amended and reenacted.” Apparently, no one has enforced a provision to prohibit tactical training thus far. You can bet your bottom dollar they will now.”
Taking a deeper dive into these waters, Max asks this. “Would you want some dudes down the road training in firearms and explosives with the purpose of conducting terrorist activities? I don’t think so.”
But that’s exactly what’s happening as we speak. There are Islamist paramilitary training compounds operating around the nation today, one of them in Rock Hill, South Carolina. I recall discussing this face to face a few years ago with John Guandolo at Understanding the Threat. To the best of our knowledge, this camp is still in operation with no pressure to cease operations. And take special note – South Carolina also has a law similar to the one in Virginia, i.e., S.C. Code 16-8-20. To date, no officer of South Carolina has used this law to shut down the camp in Rock Hill. One of those training camps is also in Virginia, and the Sheriff has defended them.
So there will indeed be bias in the application of this Virginia law. Besides, what constitutes a “terrorist activity” is in the eyes of the beholder. To some, an Islamist training camp constitutes a terrorist threat. Others couldn’t seem to care less (viz. the officers of SC). To some, patriots training for protection of home and hearth, or for protection against a tyrannical government, constitutes a terrorist threat.
Max and others have to remember that the way this all plays out will be a function of overzealous prosecutors and jurors who are soccer moms from Alexandria, Virginia, whose husbands probably work in some sort of government work. To them, an open carrier is a terroristic threat, and especially two open carriers who go to dinner with their families. Two or more guys who go rucking in the mountains while carrying rifles as part of their own personal fitness training would certainly be perceived by soccer moms in Alexandria as a threat. Remember what David Codrea has recently observed concerning this: “Eyes of the beholder.”
As for those documents Max has his students sign, I hope it works out to protect him, but we’ve seen that the FedGov apparently intends to monitor financial transactions on firearms, and monitor social media in an Orwellian pre-crime program. If the government finds social media posts they don’t like from one of the “tactical studies” students, that agreement they signed might not be worth the paper it’s printed on. Whether the instructor knew the alleged “real” intent of receiving the training or not may not make any difference. And whether the FedGov or state officers of Virginia really know the intent of receipt of the training is questionable, because it all goes to state of mind.
However, I certainly agree with Max that the larger threat concerns anti-2A laws concerning firearms. This is the holy grail for the collectivists, and it’s where they will focus all of their energy. But the bills on firearms and Senate Bill No. 64 are coupled – they are corollaries of each other. It will be illegal to own certain firearms, and it will be illegal to receive training on those firearms, perhaps to the extent of range training at gun clubs or even for concealed handgun permits. Time will tell how far this goes.
So the law existed before, but it will be reenacted with some modifications. I see this as a threat to liberties, and the enforcement of it may become a model for other states.