New York Court Holds Stun Gun Ban is Not Unconstitutional, in Contravention of Caetano

Herschel Smith · 30 Mar 2025 · 2 Comments

Dean Weingarten has a good find at Ammoland. Judge Eduardo Ramos, the U.S. District Judge for the Southern District of New York,  has issued an Opinion & Order that a ban on stun guns is constitutional. A New York State law prohibits the private possession of stun guns and tasers; a New York City law prohibits the possession and selling of stun guns. Judge Ramos has ruled these laws do not infringe on rights protected by the Second Amendment of the United States Constitution. Let's briefly…… [read more]

Ordinary Australians Versus The Police

BY Herschel Smith
3 years, 10 months ago

So I have a suggestion to the cops.  If you don’t want to be hated, and if you don’t want to be on the receiving end of things like this, then don’t be a tyrant.

That’s simple enough.

A Painful Lesson On The History Of The NRA And Gun Control

BY Herschel Smith
3 years, 10 months ago

Ammoland.

Now, let me just preface this by saying that I am a proud NRA member, a benefactor member, and have helped do many things for NRA. I am not anti-NRA at all. But what I’m going to tell you is, in effect, a painful history of things that occurred early on in the NRA. As the removal of the Robert E. Lee statue, removing this painful history is not a good idea. We need to know and understand it. It is generally not known out there, but by recognizing it, we can look at the mistakes that were made, and mistakes were made. I am not talking about the modern situation now with the attack by the New York State Attorney General and all the politics going on here. Questions about whether Wayne LaPierre should stay in leadership or not. None of that. I am not going to get into that, and it is not about that. I want to look at the actual history of the NRA when it comes to gun control and gun laws.

You may be surprised to know that back in the 1920s and into the 30s, NRA was a proponent of gun control, and actually aggressively pursued the enactment of gun control laws. Laws that to this day, we are fighting. Laws to this day that the NRA is now fighting and has been fighting for many years to repeal and get rid of. But we need to know and understand what mistakes NRA made, and it was really done out of those folks being naive. If you want to read more about this, there is a really interesting article, believe it or not, in The Atlantic, which is a magazine that is generally considered, you know, left-wing, liberal without a doubt. But they had an article called The Secret History of Guns by Adam Winkler in the September 2011 issue.

It is a very interesting article to read. As much as I do not care for the politics of The Atlantic, and there, of course, is an agenda behind everything they do, this article does have many things in it that are factually true and surprising about guns and the history of guns. The fact that is put out by a liberal, left-wing magazine, and there is an agenda to it, does not mean that the history there is necessarily untrue or that we should reject it, want to close our eyes to it, and remove the statue. No, no, not a good idea. Instead, we should embrace it, understand it, and learn from it.

So, let me tell you that in the 1920s, NRA was actually a champion of enacting gun control. Because at that time, it had come over from England where there was gun control being pushed, and it came across the pond. It was after World War One, and there was this kind of a naive concept that gun laws could maybe work and go at crime and other concerns. The President of the NRA at the time was Karl T. Frederick. Karl Frederick was a Princeton and Harvard-educated lawyer. He was known as the best shot in America because he won three gold medals in handgun shooting at the 1920 Summer Olympics. So, he was a good shooter, obviously, a skilled shooter, and he was President of the NRA at the time. He was made a special consultant to the National Conference of Commissioners on uniform state laws.

In this role and during his NRA presidency, Frederick drafted what was called the Uniform Firearm Act. The Uniform Firearm Act was model legislation that was pushed in the States at the time throughout America with the NRA and Frederick pushing these uniform firearm laws because they wanted to see gun laws in all the states. It is shocking even say it, but what did these gun laws, these model firearm laws, what did they promote? Back in the 20s? I will tell you what they did. Number one, they required anyone that wanted to carry a concealed handgun in public must have a permit from the local police. Advocating permits. When what we had prior to that was constitutional carry. We had constitutional carry, and the NRA under Frederick pushed to not have constitutional carry and in fact have permits.

And he goes on but leaves the list woefully incomplete.  There’s support for the NFA (and Hughes Amendment) and GCA, support for the original assault weapons ban, support for universal background checks, and the idea for the bump stock ban, and Trump was too stupid to be able to figure out that the NRA doesn’t have the support of modern gun owners but instead represents gun controllers.

A commenter posts this about the NRA National Firearms Museum.

“I’m the former senior curator for the NRA National Firearms Museum. Forced to retire after more than a year on furlough. Most NRA furloughed employees received no information on what was happening to the association.  The designated staff chosen to “operate” various NRA functions were pretty much ones pledged to LaPierre. No matter what happens – I fear the NRA National Firearms Museum is toast.  Believe they may have already sent part of the collection off for auction.  When I went in to pick up my personal belongings (which was one heck of a process) – they would not let me, our museum registrar, or our FFL person into the galleries for even a goodbye photo.  Interesting that they wouldn’t let an employee of 35 years (and the individual entrusted with the keys to every vault in the HQ) enter the galleries, but had allowed some VIP tours through previously.

“Millions of dollars are represented in the collection – just the Petersen Gallery held over $30 million and that was just the first gallery as you entered. The state of the HQ building is very bad presently – roof falling apart – they had to move the legal library from the 6th floor to another building next door because the roof collapsed in that area. Heard they believe it may take three more months to fully repair.”

That’s not from some outsider, but from the Senior Curator of the National Firearms Museum. And what will the board do? The board that has a legal obligation to protect the NRA as an organization? To protect the donations of those who support it? We can watch them re-elect the CEO LaPierre, continue his $1 million-plus salary, and give his cronies another year to complete their looting. This organization has endured 150 years. Founded by Civil War veterans, had 3-4 presidents who earned the Medal of Honor. It is now being ruined by a board too frightened of nasty words to do their duty.

This post is updated.

Update — a person affiliated with headquarters in the 1990s said there were many rumors back then that, while the museum itself was honest, some of the others who dealt with it were not. It would regularly receive collections, sometimes very big and fine ones, but not of museum-display quality. These would be given to an auction house to sell. There were rumors of insiders getting “first pick.” Also the possibility of kickbacks from the auction house to insiders who steered it business. At one point a staffer stumbled across a different firearm auction house that would offer NRA a better deal, and suggested that to Treasurer Woody Phillips’ staff. The person to whom he made the suggestion responded by going frantic and screaming at him until he left.

So even now they can’t stop their thievery.  They (I assume LaPierre and his cronies) are looting the NRA National Firearms Museum for personal gain and financial protection.

Wayne LaPierre, Marion Hammer, Tom King and the rest of that ilk are terrible, horrible, no good, very bad people.  But most readers, I think, see this piece for what it is.

Yes, go ahead and admit that the old NRA made mistakes.  I’m a proud NRA member, and we can all learn from this and move forward to make the new NRA.  In other words, please send us your hard earned money and we can make it all better.

Here’s a one word answer: NO.

“We Are Under Attack”: Smith & Wesson CEO Says Gun Legislation Forced The Move Away From Springfield

BY Herschel Smith
3 years, 10 months ago

News from Springfield, with some running commentary.

SPRINGFIELD — Smith & Wesson president and CEO Mark Smith says the company doesn’t want to make an enemy of the state of Massachusetts.

But he feels at least some lawmakers have made an enemy of Smith & Wesson with legislation that would ban the manufacture in Massachusetts of firearms that are unlawful to sell here.

The legislation is a response to mass shootings involving semiautomatic rifles made by Smith & Wesson and other companies. Advocates say high-capacity magazines and high rates of fire make the guns too dangerous for civilian hands.

Whether you have enemies is sometimes not up to you.

“We are under attack by the state of Massachusetts,” Smith said Friday.

CEO for two years and operations director for a decade before that, Smith gave a tour of the bustling, half-million-square-foot factory a day after announcing the company would move its headquarters and 550 jobs in production and management to gun-friendly Maryville, Tennessee. It’s not a move the company wanted to make, he said.

It will cost $125 milli million “that I didn’t want to spend,” Smith said.

Riding a wave of brisk gun sales, mostly to first time-buyers, Smith & Wesson said revenue hit $1.1 billion in the most recent fiscal year, up from $529.6 million a year earlier.

“Why would I disrupt that?” he said.

Smith & Wesson said it is relocating a total of 750 jobs to Tennessee from Springfield and its other sites. The company is also closing a plastics factory in Connecticut and a Missouri distribution center it opened in 2019.

Construction in Maryville is expected to begin later in 2021 and be substantially complete by the summer of 2023. No employees will move for two years.

A substantial operation will stay in Springfield, including the forge, machine shop and revolver assembly. There will still be 1,000 jobs here, many of them highly skilled and high-paying, the company said.

I understand the felt need to keep highly skilled revolver mechanics on staff rather than lose them due to a forced move, but this may not be up to S&W.  More on that later.

In just more than three years when the transition is complete, Smith & Wesson’s revolvers will still be manufactured here and stamped “Springfield, Massachusetts.” But the company’s semiautomatic rifles — the industry calls them modern sporting rifles while opponents say assault rifles — and semiautomatic pistols will be made in Tennessee.

News reports from Tennessee said Smith & Wesson may buy the land for only $1. It is part of a larger incentive package that includes seven-year tax abatement that could result in about $8 million in company savings, according to sources The Daily Times granted anonymity because they were not authorized to speak about the deal.

That’s corporate welfare, and in I’m opposed to it.  The move should have been made a very long time ago, and the market should dictate where they move, not incentives.

Smith & Wesson said its move was prompted by legislation proposed earlier this year by Springfield state Rep. Bud L. Williams and others that would outlaw part of its manufacturing business. That includes feeding devices capable of containing 10 or more rounds, trigger pulls requiring pressure less than 10 pounds, threaded barrels that accept silencers and other military-looking hardware.

“They are moving their headquarters. That’s what corporate does. We are trying to save lives,” Williams said this week.

John Rosenthal, a co-founder of Stop Handgun Violence, which backs the bill, said Thursday’s announcement came the same day as the fourth-anniversary of the Las Vegas shooting where a gunman fired on a concert crowd. Fifty-eight people were killed that night, and two others died later. More than 850 were injured.

If that’s what really happened in Las Vegas, then release and honest and true report explaining how the room was spotless after thousands of rounds had been discharged in that room, rather than covered in soot, carbon and powder residue.

Smith said Friday that it was the proposed law that prompted the move. The products the legislation singles out are what consumers want, and they make up 60% percent of Smith & Wesson’s sales, he said. Limiting those products for sale to the military or law enforcement isn’t feasible because Smith & Wesson’s share of those markets is too small.

Be sure to understand that it’s not just the AR-15 suite of products that the communists don’t like in our hands, it’s the M&P pistols too.

Smith — no relation to the company co-founder — said it doesn’t matter that the proposal is just a bill, one of dozens filed each year that often don’t get a hearing, much less a vote on Beacon Hill.

“Honestly, we know we could have defeated it this session,” Smith said. “But it will be back the next session and the session after that.”

It will take years to move the operation, he said. So if the company waited for the bill to pass, it’d be too late.

“I just can’t operate with that big a risk hanging over the company,” he said. “We only started this process once the bill was filed. Then and only then.”

Once Smith and his executives decided they had to move, they found it made sense to close the Missouri and Connecticut plants as well and consolidate some operations in Tennessee.

The plastic parts from Deep River, Connecticut, go into the rifles and pistols, so that needs to be near the assembly lines. The distribution system needed to move from Missouri.

“But it was the need to move from this law that triggered all the other discussions,” Smith said. “We didn’t want to do this.”

The forges, giant steel hammers that shape aluminum or carbon steel, pounding parts out of metal blocks, are hard to move. So are hundreds of computer numerical control milling machines used to shape the metal. That’s why they’ll stay in Springfield.

Revolvers don’t have attributes targeted by the proposed law, so work assembling them will also stay here. It’s painstaking work that takes a great deal of training and experience. Assemblers dry-fire the weapons and adjust them based on the sound of the metallic click until they get it just right. It’s why the jobs that are staying are so highly paid.

You should move everything, excepting nothing at all, not even the heavy equipment.  Oh, and rather than “Revolvers don’t have attributes targeted by the proposed law,” you should have said “Revolvers don’t have attributes targeted by the proposed law at the moment.”  Try, try to understand.  It isn’t just semi-automatics they communists don’t like.  It’s any firearm in the hands of anyone but a state actor.  Semiautomatics are just in line first.  They’ll eventually have the bolt action deer hunting rights locked up tight at a state armory to be checked out only by state-approved hunters for the duration of the hunt.  Anything else that fires a projectile will be anathema in the hands of anyone who isn’t functioning on behalf of the state.

“If I was doing this to save a dime, why would I leave the highest-paid jobs behind?” Smith said. “We love Springfield. We love Mayor (Domenic J.) Sarno. We didn’t want to leave.”

You shouldn’t love him.  He hates you and wants to see you out of business.  And you shouldn’t want to stay in a place like that.

Some workers whose jobs are not moving have asked to relocate anyway. That’ll open up a Springfield position for someone on the relocation list who wants to stay.

“We want to take as many of our workers with us as we can,” he said.

Good.  You should take all of them, and if some don’t want to leave and they happen to be revolver mechanics, then make them understand that they won’t have a job in two years and in the mean time it’s their responsibility to train other revolver mechanics.

“The message is to highlight the area,” he said. “We are going to be talking about what it’s like to raise your family here. We are going to talk about residential prospects, what housing is like.”

Muir said the region sells itself as an outdoor recreation hub close to Knoxville, with the University of Tennessee, and to Nashville.

“Our pitch, at least in Blount County, is that we are the peaceful side of the Smokies,” he said. “Get a cabin and enjoy the mountains peacefully. It’s just a way to get away and relax in a calm area.”

Get out of communist areas like Massachusetts, and towards more liberty.  You won’t regret it.

Is a Daniel Defense AR-15 Worth the Money? The DDM4 V7 Review

BY Herschel Smith
3 years, 10 months ago

Whether a product is worth the price, recall from Mike Vanderboegh, depends upon what it can demand on the market.  DD can demand this kind of money, and thus, they are worth the money – to a least enough buyers to keep them in business, and expand their business to become one of the largest AR-15 manufacturers in the game.

Smith & Wesson Ditches Massachusetts For Move To Tennessee

BY Herschel Smith
3 years, 10 months ago

ZeroHedge.

Less than six months after gunmaker Kimber Mfg. moved from New York to Alabama due in part to ‘gun and business-friendly support’ from the red state, Smith & Wesson is moving out of Massachusetts – and will relocate its headquarters to Maryville, Tennessee in 2023, according to Bloomberg.

The nation’s largest gun manufacturer cited restrictive legislation currently under consideration in Mass., which if enacted, would prohibit the company from manufacturing certain guns in the state they’ve called home for nearly 170 years.

These bills would prevent Smith & Wesson from manufacturing firearms that are legal in almost every state in America and that are safely used by tens of millions of law-abiding citizens every day exercising their Constitutional 2nd Amendment rights, protecting themselves and their families, and enjoying the shooting sports,” said SWBI CEO Mark Smith.

“While we are hopeful that this arbitrary and damaging legislation will be defeated in this session, these products made up over 60% of our revenue last year, and the unfortunate likelihood that such restrictions would be raised again led to a review of the best path forward for Smith & Wesson,” he added.

The move will bring 750 jobs to Maryville, along with a $125 million investment, according to the Wall Street Journal, citing the Tennessee Department of Economic & Community Development.

Lower cost of living was also a factor in the move, according to Smith.

Springfield Mayor Domenic Sarno said in a statement that the move will cost the city 550 job, which he described as ‘devastating’ for the families involved. The city said they would attempt to work with the gunmaker to try and retain 1,000 remaining jobs.

According to a person familiar with the move, the company will keep some production in Springfield.

The good.  S&W is moving.  What took you so long?  You should have made this move a long time ago to grab a part of Gun Valley Moves South (and here is Part II).

The bad.  You should have made this move a long time ago.  You waited too long, just at the time when housing prices are at a peak.

The ugly.  You’re leaving some manufacturing in Massachusetts.  This is a bad move, and you’ll live to regret it, from unionization from one plant to another, to further restrictions on firearms manufacturing.  What – you don’t really think this is the last, do you?  It’s better to get it all done at one time.

RFID Tags On Weapons?

BY Herschel Smith
3 years, 10 months ago

Seriously?

Determined to keep track of their guns, some U.S. military units have turned to a technology that could let enemies detect troops on the battlefield, The Associated Press has found.

The rollout on Army and Air Force bases continues even though the Department of Defense itself describes putting the technology in firearms as a “significant” security risk.

The Marines have rejected radio frequency identification technology in weapons for that very reason, and the Navy said this week that it was halting its own dalliance.

RFID, as the technology is known, is infused throughout daily civilian life. Thin RFID tags help drivers zip through toll booths, hospitals locate tools and supermarkets track their stock. Tags are in some identity documents, airline baggage tags and even amusement park wristbands.

When embedded in military guns, RFID tags can trim hours off time-intensive tasks, such as weapon counts and distribution. Outside the armory, however, the same silent, invisible signals that help automate inventory checks could become an unwanted tracking beacon.

The AP scrutinized how the U.S. armed services use technology to keep closer control of their firearms as part of an investigation into stolen and missing military guns — some of which have been used in street violence. The examination included new field tests that demonstrated some of the security issues RFID presents.

The field tests showed how tags inside weapons can be quickly copied, giving would-be thieves in gun rooms and armories a new advantage.

And, more crucially, that even low-tech enemies could identify U.S. troops at distances far greater than advertised by contractors who install the systems.

Which is why a spokesman for the Department of Defense said its policymakers oppose embedding tags in firearms except in limited, very specific cases, such as guns that are used only at a firing range — not in combat or to guard bases.

“It would pose a significant operations security risk in the field, allowing an adversary to easily identify DOD personnel operating locations and potentially even their identity,” Pentagon spokesman Lt. Col. Uriah Orland told AP.

Spokespeople at the headquarters of the Air Force and Army said they did not know how many units have converted their armories.

AP found five Air Force bases that have operated at least one RFID armory, and one more that plans a retrofit. Executives at military contracting companies said many more units have sought proposals.

A Florida-based Army Green Berets unit, the 7th Special Forces Group, confirmed it uses the technology in “a few” arms rooms. Special forces soldiers can take tagged weapons into the field, said Maj. Dan Lessard, a special forces spokesman. A separate pilot project at Fort Bragg, the sprawling Army base in North Carolina, was suspended due to COVID-19.

The Navy told AP one armory on a base up the coast from Los Angeles was using RFID for inventory. Then this week, after extended questioning, spokesman Lt. Lewis Aldridge abruptly said that the technology “didn’t meet operational requirements” and wouldn’t be used across the service.

There’s nothing like giving your enemy a rapid review of troop locations for artillery targeting.

The same people who came up with the plan to close Bagram Air Base must have thought up this genius plan.

The Original M16 Manual Was a Vietnam War Comic Book

BY Herschel Smith
3 years, 10 months ago

Military.com.

Most importantly, the new M16A1 came with a cleaning kit, lubricant and an entertaining field manual, drawn by Will Eisner, the former Army comic artist who designed vehicle manuals in World War II. It was called “The M-16A1 Rifle: Operation and Preventative Maintenance,” otherwise known as “Department of the Army Pamphlet 750-30.”

[ … ]

The comic was easy to read, entertaining and — above all — a familiar look to American GIs in Vietnam. Many of them would have been familiar with “The Spirit,” a comic about a Batman-like masked vigilante he created before the United States entered World War II.

By 1968, more American troops in Vietnam began to accept the use of the rifle as malfunction incidents decreased dramatically. The powder used in the 5.56 cartridge was upgraded to reduce the fouling of various parts of the weapon. By 1969, the M16A1 was fully accepted as the standard infantry weapon for the U.S. military.

I’ll bet if you had an original of this it would be worth a lot of money.

The Use Of Mineral Spirits For Gun Cleaning

BY Herschel Smith
3 years, 10 months ago

If you recall when discussing the Beretta 1301, I posed the question why Ernest used mineral spirits to clean shotguns rather than routine stuff (e.g., Hoppes solvent).  I never got any answers from my smart readers, so I posed the question to Langdon Tactical, and got this answer.

Hoppes is a Bore solvent only. Mineral Spirits cleans the inside and outside and doesn’t leave any residue. We recommend Lucas gun oil, we have found that it is the best overall oil.

Slugs are personal preference, you’re able to use them no issues, but it’s all preference whether to use rifled or not. We don’t recommend any chokes, we believe what the gun comes with works the best!

I may have to try out Lucas gun oil.  I don’t have any of that.

I thought you might be interested.

New Ammunition Production Capabilities, And Shutdown Of Old Capabilities

BY Herschel Smith
3 years, 10 months ago

Ammoland.

Mr. Mann told me he is producing 35 million to 45 million rounds of ammo a month. The operation runs seven days a week for 21 of every 24 hours in a day. There is no margin for error and there is no wiggle room to make up production. It is that critical. If there is a two-day statewide electrical power outage causing Ammo Inc to shut down operations, there is a very limited possibility to make up those two days of missed manufacturing.

The article also focuses on primers and how they are the bottleneck of the production campaign, as well as in the comments it’s pointed out that the safety protocol is expensive to ensure during the process.

It’s a shame, I think, that the new manufacturing capability is located in Wisconsin.  I wonder why the company chose that state, and why they didn’t choose North Carolina, South Carolina, Tennessee or Texas?

But there is also bad news for muzzle loading hunters.

Hodgdon Powder Company announced it would cease manufacturing operations at the GOEX blackpowder manufacturing facility in Camp Minden, La., effective immediately. The closure eliminates the only domestic source of blackpowder in the United States. According to a company press release, Hodgdon will evaluate “strategic options for the blackpowder business,” including a potential sale of the company.

The Camp Minden facility will wind down operations during the evaluation process. All affected employees will be retained through Dec. 31, 2021, to assist during the closure of the facility and will receive severance commensurate with their years of service. “The Hodgdon Powder Co., Inc has been honored to have been a part of the GOEX Powder legacy and sustains a fond appreciation for sporting customers who have enjoyed shooting GOEX Powders,” the release reads.

From the Hodgdon site.

Established in 1947 by Bruce and Amy Hodgdon, today, sons J.B. and Bob have grown Hodgdon Powder Company into the largest US supplier of smokeless, blackpowder and blackpowder substitute propellants. The company distributes gunpowder under the Hodgdon®, IMR®, Ramshot®, Acccurate®, Winchester®, Pyrodex®Triple Seven®, Blackhorn 209® and GOEX® brands.

This is sad news.  Tomorrow or some time this weekend, I intend to make a trip to load up on “white hots.”  If you do the muzzle loader scene, I suggest you do the same thing.

The Covid Vaccine Doesn’t Work

BY Herschel Smith
3 years, 10 months ago

Fauci.

Fauci also said that the boosters don’t keep people alive, just from experiencing severe symptoms.

What?

What?

What does that even mean?  Can you perish without experiencing severe symptoms?

In other news that makes better sense when looked at in the aggregate, 14 fully vaccinated residents in a French nursing home develop Covid-19.

Here is news from Australia.

Pay close attention to what Victoria, Australia, Health Minister Martin Foley says at the 2:45 minute mark of his comments.

Health Minister Foley announced 867 new COVID cases recorded yesterday.  During the statistical outline Foley identifies 375 people as hospitalized, 81 people in intensive care and 61 people on a ventilator.   Then comes the statistic everyone in government and media ignore.  Amid the recorded cases “78% of the hospital cases are fully vaccinated, and 17% are partially vaccinated (1 dose)”….

That means 95% of the COVID patients in Victoria hospitals are vaccinated.

356 people out of 375 patients are vaccinated, yet 81 people are still in intensive care with 61 on a ventilator.

In America, with special sympathy for the elderly.

A whistleblower has provided government data documenting 48,465 deaths within 14 days of COVID-19 vaccination among Medicare patients alone, according to medical freedom rights attorney Thomas Renz.

The announcement Saturday was made by the Ohio-based attorney, who remains involved in several major cases brought against federal agencies relating to fraud and violations of medical freedom rights.

In his presentation, Renz expressed his appreciation for whistleblowers who were coming forward to provide the public with such important information from the Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Service (CMS). He described the CMS database as the largest available in the U.S. for the study of COVID-19 trends because it contains the data of approximately 59.4 million Medicare beneficiaries.

One slide showed that the number of “persons who died within 14 days of a COVID-19 vaccine” equated to 19,400 for those younger than 81 years old, and 28,065 for those 81 and over, totaling 48,465 deaths.

“Do you want to know why 14 days is important?” he asked. “Because if you die with 14 days, you’re not considered vaccinated.” According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), one is not considered as being “vaccinated” until 14 days after their completed injection regimen, raising the question of whether government authorities have been classifying these fatalities as something other than vaccination-related deaths.

I think we all know the answer to that.

So the title of the post is The Covid Vaccine Doesn’t Work.  This is a bit tongue in cheek.  It works if the intent was to destroy the immune system.  It works like a charm.



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