You’re on a list
BY WiscoDave
5 years, 8 months ago
Day 3. The journey continues.
We start once again with a quiet recitation of A. Shepard’s Prayer.
Due to popular demand (OK, a couple of comments by James) I’ll throw my two cents out there with regards to the 3D printer files kerfluffle going on.
First off, it seems that there are files out there that have been previously released. All you have to do is look for them. They’ve been out there for years. Defense Distributed may have some newer designs they wanted to release but there are plans out there for at least the Liberator.
Secondly, I’m loving all of the “pearl clutching” and anti-gun/anti-freedom moral outrage being spewed by all of the usual suspects. Once again they can breathlessly hype (and probably fund raise off of) absolutely nothing.
C’mon, people. There already are well over 300 million guns in the USA. A few more single shot homemade ones are not going to push us off of a cliff.
If you’re working the angle that you want to make one “off of the books” you’re fooling yourself. You’re already on a list if you’ve ever done anything, belonged to anything or bought anything (by means other than cash/barter) gun related. Spending a couple grand on a special machine and then ordering special materials only to have to go and buy additional components in order to complete it does not an off the books gun make. I don’t doubt that it could be done BUT I’m guessing that you’re already on a list.
Don’t get me wrong here. I’m not in the least against someone doing it themselves. It’s just not for me. And, in my opinion, there are far better ways of spending your money.
One suggestion I have is to get a combination drill press/lathe/mill and have something that can do far more than just 3D printing. They can be had for less than $2,000. I know they’re not perfect but they’ll suffice unless you want to get separate, full sized stand alone machines. Besides, metalworking can be a fun hobby and a valuable skill.
History tells many stories of “hidden” firearms manufacturing in occupied areas. I have heard stories, but can’t verify, of Sten gun plans being dropped to the resistance in France during WWII so they could make them.
I also stumbled across this article during my browsing: http://thepeoplescube.com/peoples-blog/shovel-ready-ak-47-t10152.html. I don’t know who this guy is but he seems familiar.
In short, I’m loving it but it’s not for me. Maybe if you want to make me some of those Frito Bandito erasers from a few years back…
I’ll wait for the technology to get advanced to the point like in that old Star Wars tv show from the ’60’s. You know, where Kirk and Jeannie would ask the Tardis to make something and there it was. Yeah. I’m waiting for that.
On August 1, 2018 at 6:18 pm, GomeznSA said:
IIRC, the plans and specifications for such ‘items’ as the M3 ‘grease gun’, the Sten the Sterling and probably several other subguns have been readily available on the intrawebz for a good long while. And anyone with moderate machining and welding skills can cobble them together.
And didn’t the exact same wailers claim the same thing about the evil Glock pistols some 30 odd years ago?
On August 1, 2018 at 6:55 pm, James said:
I see this mostly as a free speech issue in that tis just drawings/code ect.,do realize tis all out there.As I mentioned before the AG’s crying just brings more folks to the table!I did like that as Defense Distributed shut down again by court strangely enough the site codeisfreespeech came up livetoday in what was supposed to DD’s library opening,some great downloads there and much not “plastic”!The AG’s could really get ruffled if they heard/read about TM31-210,been out from the US Army free for years!Alas,neither the Free speech code or Army manual has plans for the Q-36 Explosive Space Modulator,sigh……..
We are all on lists,so,might as well make the most of it and spread information far and wide.
Wisco,hope my comments didn’t interrupt a schedualed article from ya’s,doing a good job holding the fot down here,I knew the conclave with the masked furry wise ones would pay off!
On August 1, 2018 at 9:35 pm, J said:
“One suggestion I have is to get a combination drill press/lathe/mill and have something that can do far more than just 3D printing……
History tells many stories of “hidden” firearms manufacturing in occupied areas. I have heard stories, but can’t verify, of Sten gun plans being dropped to the resistance in France during WWII so they could make them.”
AMEN sir!! Bill “the rapist” Clinton is the reason i became a Armorer and am pursuing and True Gunsmith Education.
The Writing on the wall was crystal clear to me years ago. And i swore then, I will not be denied. And I shant.
On August 2, 2018 at 6:45 am, Mark Matis said:
They are also on a list. As are their enablers. And their enablers’ spouses.
On August 2, 2018 at 7:23 am, ragman said:
I built a couple of 80% lowers for a number of reasons. First of all to see if I could do it and secondly to get a much better understanding of how the things actually work. And they work very well.
On August 2, 2018 at 7:55 am, EndOfPatience said:
https://www.scribd.com/doc/2624298/sten-mk2-complete-machine-instructions
On August 2, 2018 at 9:57 am, doug said:
look up improvised guns to see all the weapons being made worldwide.
On August 2, 2018 at 5:40 pm, Gryphon said:
Wisco – My thoughts exactly… A few crude ‘homemade’ Guns on top of 300+ Million ‘real’ ones is just Silly. As for Machine Tools, it is the Rifled Barrel that is the Specialized Part that is the most Difficult to Produce, and IMO, this whole “Printed Gun” controversy is the start of an attempt by the bolsheviks to restrict ANY ‘Gun Parts’ from non-traceable Sale.
As for “Lists”, I have told people for Years that when they implemented the so-called NICS Check system that it was De-Facto ‘registration’ of Gun Buyers, notwithstanding that the ATF was ‘not allowed’ to Keep that data.
Guess What, that System is on .gov Computers OF COURSE IT IS RECORDED!
They Still, however, Cannot Win the Math; Gun Confiscation in any Meaningful Numbers will Trigger (pun always Fresh) Massive Resistance, and once Any Gun is ‘illegal’, .gov will face the Nightmare of all the Stuff ‘hidden in the Walls’ and Made Up in Garages…
Yo, Army Guys! Think what Moe Ham-Head did to You with IED’s in Sandland was Bad? Wait until the Guy who Owns a Quarry gets pissed off…
When You see the Confiscations Start, Desert Early, Beat the Rush…
On August 3, 2018 at 5:12 pm, scott s. said:
Probably worth separating the legal questions from the hype used to goad the court into issuing an injunction.
There exists a law which gives the President broad authority to control the import and export of “defense articles”. Separate regulations by Dept of State exist for exports and imports.
For exports, there exists a regulation known as “US Munitions List”. This list includes all firearms as well as “technical data” relating to firearms.
The argument is that 6 specific “files” or “CAD files” are “technical data” per the USML and thus subject to license prior to export.
Further, the argument is that making these 6 “CAD files” available for download via the internet constitute an “export”.
A procedure exists in the regs for a DoS determination of exportability (commodity jurisdiction).
The complaint is that DoS “changed its mind” about the need for a license without following the requirements of the Administrative Procedures Act (ie, issuing NPRM in the FR, receiving comments, etc).
Everything else is just handwaving. Note that aside from the printed plastic “Liberator” (source of name is obvious) there is also the so-called “ghost gunner” table-top CNC mill that is supposed to work on Aluminum billets and “80% lowers”.